tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post9223285815667364094..comments2024-03-23T02:46:06.516-07:00Comments on Of Dogs and Bike Racing: Women Can't Descend???Kimberly (aka. DrKim)http://www.blogger.com/profile/10045683251151687060noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-29883761392063853782007-05-31T12:36:00.000-07:002007-05-31T12:36:00.000-07:00There are two starts for Hamilton. The one in SJ, ...There are two starts for Hamilton. The one in SJ, and the Isabella creek start, which is at the bottom of the long descent off of Ham, right before the neutral feed. This is were the W4 and M5 fields start. So, they go up a quick bump, then down the shorter, but still technical descent (about 1.5 or two mile descent). The other fields have the 20 mile climb to sort things out before the technical descent.dr-nitrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17046521540356798995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-60238850691900574562007-05-31T12:00:00.000-07:002007-05-31T12:00:00.000-07:00Did I miss something at Hamilton?I mean I remember...Did I miss something at Hamilton?<BR/>I mean I remember getting there in<BR/>time to change, pin my number and <BR/>then warming up, which litterally<BR/>consisted of riding across the road<BR/>to the line! But I must have been<BR/>in another world because when they<BR/>said, "One two three go." I only<BR/>remember riding across a bridge and<BR/>making a right turn and immediatly<BR/>headin' UPHILL for awhile.Quite awhile.Things were somewhat strung<BR/>out by the time we hit the top of<BR/>what I thought was the first climb<BR/>but then came back together on the<BR/>first descent.<BR/>Somebody hep me here 'cause my race<BR/>did not start downhill.Auffderbachhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00620124631331025549noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-87610069515564590762007-05-31T10:31:00.000-07:002007-05-31T10:31:00.000-07:00dr-nitro: i agree with you 100%. The scariest th...dr-nitro: i agree with you 100%. The scariest thing I ever did on a bike was race the "neutral descent" at sea otter in pouring horizontal hail/rain. Talk about frightening with everyone going slow/braking/skidding/gravel and mud everywhere.... IT was just not a pleasant time. I agree that the race should probably be started at the bottom of the descent :-) if its THAT technical...but the technical descents usually work to my advantage so I don't want them all taken out! :-)Kimberly (aka. DrKim)https://www.blogger.com/profile/10045683251151687060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-71842327601455873492007-05-31T08:48:00.000-07:002007-05-31T08:48:00.000-07:00Neutralizing the descent would cause more problems...Neutralizing the descent would cause more problems, as riders would be riding into the back of each other. They should simply start the race after the descent for the short course if they think that there is a problem. It is kind of silly, if not dangerous, to have a tricky descent essentially right off the starting line for the short course, especially for the lower categories where the skill level among the riders is not as developed. <BR/><BR/>End of the day, though, bike racing requires skill. Anything that negates the value of skill takes away from the sport. Thus, neutralizing technical sections takes away from the sport. Race, people, and race safely.dr-nitrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17046521540356798995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-33879624187540455832007-05-31T01:24:00.000-07:002007-05-31T01:24:00.000-07:00I haven't seen the course, but safety has to be ke...I haven't seen the course, but safety has to be key, be it Cat 4 women or Cat 5 men, etc. Both have a mix of skill levels that could get out of hand in a hurry on a sketchy section of course.<BR/><BR/>However, statements like "women can't decend" are just dumb.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16723257103071171990noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-61623400409081029312007-05-30T15:36:00.000-07:002007-05-30T15:36:00.000-07:00auffderbach: I like the idea of a descent test! ...auffderbach: I like the idea of a descent test! I, too, am a descender. I love to take the turns as fast and as tight as I can manage...hitting the apex just right and feeling the gravity work. Awesome. I LOVED laguna seca for that reason..how awesome was that! I was having bike issues that day (a broken barrel adjuster keeping my cable from lengthening enough and not letting me shift into the big ring), so I got to chase down EVERY lap! And so every lap i got to catch back up, except the last one when i couldnt quite make it and sprinted in for 7th... <BR/><BR/>I know what you mean...I do better when I can show off those descending skills...its part of the race...so get the skills to do it! <BR/><BR/>It's just dangerous when you screw up (as my shoulder knows all too well...), but part of the game...Kimberly (aka. DrKim)https://www.blogger.com/profile/10045683251151687060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-64346620475753055862007-05-30T15:20:00.000-07:002007-05-30T15:20:00.000-07:00As an old dude who can't get the upgrade points du...As an old dude who can't get the <BR/>upgrade points due to too small of<BR/>a field, I'm surrounded by cat4's<BR/>and 5's in most of my races. <BR/>Now I may not be the fittest rider<BR/>out there but having grown up in<BR/>Lake Tahoe and climbed and descended EVERY mountain pass around here, I can say with confidence, " I know how to descend<BR/>down a mountain."<BR/><BR/>At Hamilton there were many who didn't seem to have a clue and it<BR/>was a friggin' pain dealing with<BR/>them. I had to hit the brakes to keep from getting clipped by folks<BR/>who don't know what an apex is over<BR/>and over.When push came to shove, I<BR/>finally just let them know I was a<BR/>comin' up on their inside and that<BR/>it would be good if they stayed where they were. I think I scared<BR/>most of them but by the time they<BR/>got it back together, I was long<BR/>gone. Of course they would eventually catch me on the climbs but by then there was too much panting for anyone to talk!<BR/><BR/>It's not the women. I've personally<BR/>descended with some ladies that rode me off their wheel at 55 - 60<BR/>mph going down Monitor or Kingsburry or Mt. Rose, etc,etc.<BR/><BR/>The bummer of it is, is if they<BR/>neutralize the downhill, there goes<BR/>any chance of me doing halfway decent. <BR/><BR/>Maybe there should be some sort of<BR/>class where you HAVE to go down the<BR/>cork screw at Laguna Seca and into<BR/>turn 9 flat out until you have figured out how to make that corner. Or the first turn at the <BR/>Nevada City Classic. If you can't<BR/>pass the test, no race.Auffderbachhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00620124631331025549noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-46474247044629498202007-05-30T11:19:00.000-07:002007-05-30T11:19:00.000-07:00Sounds like a neutral section would be good for th...Sounds like a neutral section would be good for the first descent, for ALL riders. I just didn't like the insinuation that women were somehow less skilled at descending...<BR/><BR/>I agree that the first few miles of a race are usually the sketchiest...it makes sense...all that pent-up stress and excitement.Kimberly (aka. DrKim)https://www.blogger.com/profile/10045683251151687060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-91498241935918486532007-05-30T10:13:00.000-07:002007-05-30T10:13:00.000-07:00Preach it, sister!Velogirl is right, too. I was ac...Preach it, sister!<BR/><BR/>Velogirl is right, too. I was actually suprised the first 2 miles weren't neutralized (for all categories starting at Isabel Creek). People (not just women) tend to be most sketchy in the first few minutes of a race. And, because we had just come off a 1 mile steep climb with attacks, I'm sure the sketchiness was even greater, due to lack of oxygen to the brain. And, it's a very technical descent with off camber corners - a perfect setup for those who are fit but not skilled to hang themselves in the heat of the moment. <BR/><BR/>Of course, I'm skilled but not fit (at least in the climbing sense), so I had a nice solo descent until I came across the pileup....I would have appreciated a neutralization for that hill so I wasn't out of the race in the first 3 minutes. I could have survived the next two smaller hills with the pack and probably would have made it to the big climb in the group, which would have been a much better race experience for me. As it was, I had a training ride.chatterboxhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03863147093732489120noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-44338327737835254872007-05-29T22:17:00.000-07:002007-05-29T22:17:00.000-07:00Marla Streb is awesome. I met her this year, and ...Marla Streb is awesome. I met her this year, and was most awed. She has such a great story...and wow can she ride!<BR/><BR/>Velogirl: You're right, having not been on that course, I cannot comment on the particulars of that descent. But I would bet that men crash on that, too. I think if they neutralize for the womens 4s, they should neutralize that descent for the mens 5's as well...<BR/><BR/>I'm sure there are also women who enjoy the technical descents that would not be so happy with a neutral descent. The neutral descent at sea otter was one of my least favorite moments on the bike, ever (that could have been due to the horizontal rain and mud though)! <BR/><BR/>Interesting topic, to be sure.Kimberly (aka. DrKim)https://www.blogger.com/profile/10045683251151687060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-22616567998043749132007-05-29T22:03:00.000-07:002007-05-29T22:03:00.000-07:00while I'm also offended by that type of comment, t...while I'm also offended by that type of comment, there have been crashes in the W4 race on that particular descent for many years. <BR/><BR/>Kim, you're correct in your assessment of the diversity of skill levels in the W4 fields. there is also a diversity of fitness levels (and not necessarily in corelation with the skill levels).<BR/><BR/>if the officials feel they can make the race safer by neutralizing through that 1st descent, my guess is there are at least three women (the 3 who crashed this year) who would nave appreciated that, not to mention all the women who have crashed on that same descent in years past.Lorri Lee Lown -- velogirlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16206645828472852633noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-67096995649378467052007-05-29T21:51:00.000-07:002007-05-29T21:51:00.000-07:00Holy cow, Batman! I expect that kind of conversati...Holy cow, Batman! I expect that kind of conversation in a bar, but by officials at a bike race? It's the males that need heli-lifted off the mountain for going down the backside of ham too fast (W4 don't even go down that descent for reasons of distance not skill).<BR/><BR/>The idiot official should be made to try to follow someone like Marla Streb down a hill, and if he could not follow her, should be made to take her skills clinic (http://www.marlastreb.com/clinics.html).dr-nitrohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17046521540356798995noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-20947447665913950052007-05-29T21:20:00.000-07:002007-05-29T21:20:00.000-07:00cyclistrick...I know the reason you mentioned it, ...cyclistrick...I know the reason you mentioned it, and I appreciate you doing so! We have to stand up to these narrow minded individuals... <BR/><BR/>And thanks to people like you, who support the people like Ms. Chatterbox and myself, the trail is getting wider.<BR/><BR/>Thanks!!!Kimberly (aka. DrKim)https://www.blogger.com/profile/10045683251151687060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2032407315425429714.post-90855508058820836362007-05-29T21:13:00.000-07:002007-05-29T21:13:00.000-07:00drkim - I am with you. The reason I mentioned the...drkim - I am with you. The reason I mentioned the comment on my blog was that it thought it rather ridiculous, a narrow minded view supported by bias not fact. I believe the comment was in response to a crash in the W4 field on the first descent of the day. But I did not hear any comment about steps to prevent the crash near the finish in the M5 category. <BR/><BR/>I applaud women, like yourself, Ms Chatterbox, and so many others I know, who go out in spite of these narrow-minded views and prove over and over that you are up to any task. Take your bows, and know there are some of us (men) who believe in you, laud your accomplishments, and stand in awe of all who prove by doing.Itinerant Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14507102777492877721noreply@blogger.com